Comments on: How not to measure temperature, part 54: Los Angeles, the city http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/ Commentary on puzzling things in life, nature, science, weather, climate change, technology, and recent news by Anthony Watts Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:48:30 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: How not to measure temperature, part 69 « Watts Up With That? http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-33469 How not to measure temperature, part 69 « Watts Up With That? Sun, 24 Aug 2008 03:56:06 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-33469 [...] The article was fairly well written, citing JPL climatologist Dr. Bill Patzert who also was the source on a  previous story we examined looking at the problems associated with the move of Los Angeles official weather station. [...] [...] The article was fairly well written, citing JPL climatologist Dr. Bill Patzert who also was the source on a  previous story we examined looking at the problems associated with the move of Los Angeles official weather station. [...]

]]> By: TrWord http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-12139 TrWord Sat, 19 Apr 2008 00:07:03 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-12139 Thanks.. Thanks..

]]> By: cv http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-10097 cv Tue, 01 Apr 2008 04:07:04 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-10097 Great work, a little info for you on the USC site. My family and at least four other groups use that little area for tailgating during football season. The building across the street is a post office with roof parking The station is well fenced and appears to be well maintained with nice shade trees. The street next to the station is Vermont Blvd, a main bus route in that part of town. Great work, a little info for you on the USC site. My family and at least four other groups use that little area for tailgating during football season. The building across the street is a post office with roof parking The station is well fenced and appears to be well maintained with nice shade trees. The street next to the station is Vermont Blvd, a main bus route in that part of town.

]]> By: DrD http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9645 DrD Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:13:54 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9645 It's a setup I tell you, a dirty, lousy frame. You dirty rat, I'm gonna get you, for what you did, to my weather station! It’s a setup I tell you, a dirty, lousy frame. You dirty rat, I’m gonna get you, for what you did, to my weather station!

]]> By: kelly http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9636 kelly Fri, 28 Mar 2008 15:14:04 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9636 Great tale, I could almost see Steve Martin feeling up Racheal Ward in " Dead men Don't Wear Plaid. Has a Nobel prize/ academy award ever been revoked? ............the shame Great tale, I could almost see Steve Martin feeling up Racheal Ward in ” Dead men Don’t Wear Plaid.
Has a Nobel prize/ academy award ever been revoked? …………the shame

]]> By: steven mosher http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9484 steven mosher Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:44:41 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9484 Ok I'll correct the record over at ATMOZ Ok I’ll correct the record over at ATMOZ

]]> By: steven mosher http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9477 steven mosher Thu, 27 Mar 2008 13:28:57 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9477 Anthony,, Mike C reports that NCDC has removed the observer data again from the online system. have a look. spotted on ATMOZ <strong>REPLY:</strong> No, just moved to the location tab, part of an upgrade and just makes better sense there. Anthony,, Mike C reports that NCDC has removed the observer data again from the online system. have a look.

spotted on ATMOZ

REPLY: No, just moved to the location tab, part of an upgrade and just makes better sense there.

]]> By: VG http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9458 VG Thu, 27 Mar 2008 08:28:25 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9458 Re NPR: me angry sorry immediate reaction remove if inappropriate here or put somewhere appropriate Concerning you story about Antarctica ice today I find it amazing that you have not checked the facts from IPCC sites University of Illinois http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/current.365.south.jpg Antarctic ice ABOVE normal for past 6 Months and growing dramatically Sea Ice Index (type in search) SH ice 35% ABOVE 2008 World mean global temperatures DECLINING since 2004 Hadcrut Hadley decline very marked recently http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/climon/data/themi/g17.htm To date declines again very marked Univ Alabama http://discover.itsc.uah.edu/amsutemps/ pick your atmospheric height Also there is intense volcnic activity underwater in that area so increasing ice in SH + warm waters underneath = ice cracks off and melts? http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/01/080120160720.htm Re NPR: me angry sorry immediate reaction remove if inappropriate here or put somewhere appropriate
Concerning you story about Antarctica ice today
I find it amazing that you have not checked the facts
from IPCC sites
University of Illinois
http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/current.365.south.jpg
Antarctic ice ABOVE normal for past 6 Months and growing dramatically
Sea Ice Index (type in search) SH ice 35% ABOVE 2008
World mean global temperatures DECLINING since 2004 Hadcrut Hadley decline very marked recently
http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/climon/data/themi/g17.htm
To date declines again very marked Univ Alabama
http://discover.itsc.uah.edu/amsutemps/
pick your atmospheric height
Also there is intense volcnic activity underwater in that area
so increasing ice in SH + warm waters underneath = ice cracks off and melts?
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/01/080120160720.htm

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9444 Evan Jones Thu, 27 Mar 2008 03:12:16 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9444 I mean, like, it's bad enough that these stations are homogenized. But why do they usually turn out to be pasteurized? I mean, like, it’s bad enough that these stations are homogenized. But why do they usually turn out to be pasteurized?

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9427 Evan Jones Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:31:53 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9427 <cite>The parking garage location would be a 5 while the USC location would be a 4.</cite> And that more or less matches the change in temp and ithus conforms with the CRN rating system. (I can almost hear the screams from a certain other blog which shall remain nameless.) The parking garage location would be a 5 while the USC location would be a 4.

And that more or less matches the change in temp and ithus conforms with the CRN rating system. (I can almost hear the screams from a certain other blog which shall remain nameless.)

]]> By: mccall http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9399 mccall Wed, 26 Mar 2008 18:24:09 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9399 Are both station classifications, LA (1999) class 5's ... doesn't look like it? <strong>REPLY:</strong> The parking garage location would be a 5 while the USC location would be a 4. Are both station classifications, LA (1999) class 5’s … doesn’t look like it?

REPLY: The parking garage location would be a 5 while the USC location would be a 4.

]]> By: Rod Smith http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9369 Rod Smith Wed, 26 Mar 2008 16:14:26 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9369 A very cleverly written article Anthony, but why didn't you run it on a "Friday?" I can't help myself!! A very cleverly written article Anthony, but why didn’t you run it on a “Friday?”

I can’t help myself!!

]]> By: whatmenthink http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9325 whatmenthink Wed, 26 Mar 2008 04:55:56 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9325 Interesting. The integrity of the data is seriously questionable if used in a time series type of analysis. Anyway, like the creative element of this post. Interesting. The integrity of the data is seriously questionable if used in a time series type of analysis. Anyway, like the creative element of this post.

]]> By: John Goetz http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9319 John Goetz Wed, 26 Mar 2008 03:27:45 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9319 And an intoxicated TCO seems to be hijacking Atmoz's blog (a shame). Now that is Total Cost of Ownership. And an intoxicated TCO seems to be hijacking Atmoz’s blog (a shame). Now that is Total Cost of Ownership.

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9317 Evan Jones Wed, 26 Mar 2008 03:16:02 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9317 Hey, Rev! Did you know you've got a write-up in Wikipedia? It's not a hatchet job, either. Check it out! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Watts Hey, Rev!

Did you know you’ve got a write-up in Wikipedia? It’s not a hatchet job, either.

Check it out!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Watts

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9316 Evan Jones Wed, 26 Mar 2008 01:33:56 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9316 BTW, that was a good tip to check out Atmoz. I urge all present to do so. Two interesting facts merge: 1.) TOBS is the biggest adjustment made by the USHCN. 2.) TOBS adjustments are being applied even when the there ain't no change in time of observation! BTW, that was a good tip to check out Atmoz. I urge all present to do so.

Two interesting facts merge:

1.) TOBS is the biggest adjustment made by the USHCN.

2.) TOBS adjustments are being applied even when the there ain’t no change in time of observation!

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9315 Evan Jones Wed, 26 Mar 2008 01:30:05 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9315 “I had a cup of coffee while I did that. It cost 25 cents, and included pie.” Now, this just can’t be true. REPLY: In the 50’s when Dragnet first aired, it was. I just wanted to be true to historical form in a lighthearted way. Ah, the Good Old Days. When coffee and cake cost a quarter. And no one had a quarter to spare! I remember well that glorious day back arouind 1964 when my allowance went up to a quarter a week. (Wealth unlimited!) “I had a cup of coffee while I did that. It cost 25 cents, and included pie.”

Now, this just can’t be true.

REPLY: In the 50’s when Dragnet first aired, it was. I just wanted to be true to historical form in a lighthearted way.

Ah, the Good Old Days. When coffee and cake cost a quarter. And no one had a quarter to spare!

I remember well that glorious day back arouind 1964 when my allowance went up to a quarter a week. (Wealth unlimited!)

]]> By: Bruce Foutch http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9311 Bruce Foutch Wed, 26 Mar 2008 00:43:26 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9311 For your reading pleasure from the Journal of Applied Meteorology: "<a href="http://ams.allenpress.com/perlserv/?request=get-abstract&doi=10.1175%2F1520-0450(1984)023%3C1520:UIOSTI%3E2.0.CO%3B2&ct=1" rel="nofollow">Urban Influences on Surface Temperatures in the Southwestern United States during Recent Decades</a> - Daniel R. Cayan, Scripts Institute of Oceanography, 1984" From the conclusion section: "This urban increase poses severe problems om using these stations as indicators of climate variability" ...and my vote for best quote of the day goes to: "Use of these city stations for verifying temperature forecasts is simply invalid..." For your reading pleasure from the Journal of Applied Meteorology:

“Urban Influences on Surface Temperatures in the Southwestern United States during Recent Decades – Daniel R. Cayan, Scripts Institute of Oceanography, 1984″

From the conclusion section:
“This urban increase poses severe problems om using these stations as indicators of climate variability”
…and my vote for best quote of the day goes to:
“Use of these city stations for verifying temperature forecasts is simply invalid…”

]]> By: McGrats http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9309 McGrats Tue, 25 Mar 2008 23:44:09 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9309 To Old Construction Worker: Interesting article. Unfortunately, certain governmental bodies are inclined to consider it irrelevant and instead, grovel to their fringe constituency. Regardless, I firmly believe the tide is shifting in the favor of the skeptics and truth is the reason, not global warming ! To Old Construction Worker:

Interesting article. Unfortunately, certain governmental bodies are inclined to consider it irrelevant and instead, grovel to their fringe constituency.

Regardless, I firmly believe the tide is shifting in the favor of the skeptics and truth is the reason, not global warming !

]]> By: bill p http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/03/24/how-not-to-measure-temperature-part-54-los-angeles-the-city/#comment-9308 bill p Tue, 25 Mar 2008 23:34:38 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=929#comment-9308 "I had a cup of coffee while I did that. It cost 25 cents, and included pie." Now, this just can't be true. <strong>REPLY: </strong>In the 50's when Dragnet first aired, it was. I just wanted to be true to historical form in a lighthearted way. “I had a cup of coffee while I did that. It cost 25 cents, and included pie.”

Now, this just can’t be true.

REPLY: In the 50’s when Dragnet first aired, it was. I just wanted to be true to historical form in a lighthearted way.

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