Comments on: NOAA: Hurricane frequency and global warming NOT the cause of increased destruction http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/ Commentary on puzzling things in life, nature, science, weather, climate change, technology, and recent news by Anthony Watts Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:48:30 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: EMVHI http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-62946 EMVHI Fri, 12 Dec 2008 17:42:54 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-62946 Regarding 50x the CO2 in the ocean. Google "Henry's Law" and "La Chatelier's Principle." Regarding 50x the CO2 in the ocean.

Google “Henry’s Law” and “La Chatelier’s Principle.”

]]> By: AH1 http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-61548 AH1 Sat, 06 Dec 2008 00:46:39 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-61548 Ahem...global warming is still happening. Methane clathrates are melting. This has been hypothesised as one of the trigger mechanisms for the Permian-Triassic mass extinction, and is a severe positive feedback mechanism for global warming, along with the melting methane in Siberia...we're reaching that tipping point now as it was discovered this September...look it up. Ahem…global warming is still happening. Methane clathrates are melting. This has been hypothesised as one of the trigger mechanisms for the Permian-Triassic mass extinction, and is a severe positive feedback mechanism for global warming, along with the melting methane in Siberia…we’re reaching that tipping point now as it was discovered this September…look it up.

]]> By: evanjones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-39630 evanjones Tue, 16 Sep 2008 02:11:10 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-39630 Six multidecadal oscillations switched from cool phase to warm phase between 1976 and 2001 (PDO, AMO, NOA, AO, AAO, IPO). A 0.4°C increase occurred (although even the magnitude of that has been called into question.) Now the PDO has gone cool. Temps are down sharply (after years of flatness). The NAO and AO may be going cold (ahead of expected schedule). I would definitely take a wait-and-see attitude before either jumping to conclusions or taking economic measures that will cost up to half of world economic growth. (An inconvenient Truth has been shot so full of holes, there really isn't much left of it. This does not disprove AGW, but it makes AIT a non-source.) Six multidecadal oscillations switched from cool phase to warm phase between 1976 and 2001 (PDO, AMO, NOA, AO, AAO, IPO). A 0.4°C increase occurred (although even the magnitude of that has been called into question.)

Now the PDO has gone cool. Temps are down sharply (after years of flatness). The NAO and AO may be going cold (ahead of expected schedule).

I would definitely take a wait-and-see attitude before either jumping to conclusions or taking economic measures that will cost up to half of world economic growth.

(An inconvenient Truth has been shot so full of holes, there really isn’t much left of it. This does not disprove AGW, but it makes AIT a non-source.)

]]> By: Maddison http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-39626 Maddison Tue, 16 Sep 2008 01:56:44 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-39626 global warming is real -> indeed :(. Sad but true. global warming is real -> indeed :(. Sad but true.

]]> By: Kk http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-30899 Kk Mon, 11 Aug 2008 10:05:42 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-30899 Load of shizzle. global warming is real. The inconvienent truth watch it aye Load of shizzle.
global warming is real.

The inconvienent truth

watch it aye

]]> By: GermanShepherd's Lair - Journal » Blog Archive » Global Warming Residue Alert http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-22918 GermanShepherd's Lair - Journal » Blog Archive » Global Warming Residue Alert Fri, 04 Jul 2008 20:26:58 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-22918 [...] Except the National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration released a paper a while ago with research and numbers proving that landfall hurricane count has NOT gone up since the whole "global warming awareness" (read: scare-mongering) has begun and has, in fact, been generally lower. Oops. [...] [...] Except the National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration released a paper a while ago with research and numbers proving that landfall hurricane count has NOT gone up since the whole “global warming awareness” (read: scare-mongering) has begun and has, in fact, been generally lower. Oops. [...]

]]> By: Global Warming Stopped 10 Years Ago. - Page 6 - Political Forum - US & World Political Discussion Forums http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-19186 Global Warming Stopped 10 Years Ago. - Page 6 - Political Forum - US & World Political Discussion Forums Sun, 15 Jun 2008 04:02:12 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-19186 [...] not caused by global heating, say scientists – Times Online Discovery News : Discovery Channel NOAA: Hurricane frequency and global warming NOT the cause of increased destruction Watts Up With … …etc.,ad [...]

]]> By: “Our Dishonest Media’s Role in History’s Greatest Scam” « Defending Reason http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-11860 “Our Dishonest Media’s Role in History’s Greatest Scam” « Defending Reason Tue, 15 Apr 2008 21:06:24 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-11860 [...] made landfall between 1851-1005 and conclusively found that hurricane intensity had not increased. (http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-...). What the study did find, and what Al Gore Jr. will tell you, is that the damage done by [...] [...] made landfall between 1851-1005 and conclusively found that hurricane intensity had not increased. (http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-…). What the study did find, and what Al Gore Jr. will tell you, is that the damage done by [...]

]]> By: Hurricane expert reconsiders global warming’s impact « Watts Up With That? http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-11362 Hurricane expert reconsiders global warming’s impact « Watts Up With That? Sat, 12 Apr 2008 00:57:25 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-11362 [...] I previously reported in my post titled: Hurricane frequency and global warming NOT the cause of increased destruction, it appears that the “link” cited by Gore and others trying to equate global warming to [...] [...] I previously reported in my post titled: Hurricane frequency and global warming NOT the cause of increased destruction, it appears that the “link” cited by Gore and others trying to equate global warming to [...]

]]> By: Anthony Isgar http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-11017 Anthony Isgar Wed, 09 Apr 2008 15:17:03 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-11017 Yes it is, I forgot that Anthony was the name of the blog host. I'll put my last name on here now. Yes it is, I forgot that Anthony was the name of the blog host. I’ll put my last name on here now.

]]> By: Anthony http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-10969 Anthony Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:01:34 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-10969 @ Jeff Cosmic rays have been experimentally determined to be able to produce ultra-small aerosol particles. These particles act as cloud condensation nuclei. It is still classified as a Theory, it has not yet been made into a Law. The test was done at Stanford I believe, and is scheduled to be redone in London and a Russian lab to determine it validity. There have been no tests to disprove it yet. If you do a google or youtube search for "The Great Global Warming Swindle" you can see the direct correlation sunspot activity vs global temperature. As the Sunspot activity goes down, the magnetic field of the the sun is weaker, and that allows more cosmic rays into out solar system. The reverse is also true. That is why over the past 30 years, every planet in our solar system that has weather has experienced warming. According to Mr Gore, Mars has global warming because someone parked their SuV there. :) <strong>REPLY: </strong>FYI this is a different Anthony than the blog host @ Jeff

Cosmic rays have been experimentally determined to be able to produce ultra-small aerosol particles. These particles act as cloud condensation nuclei. It is still classified as a Theory, it has not yet been made into a Law. The test was done at Stanford I believe, and is scheduled to be redone in London and a Russian lab to determine it validity. There have been no tests to disprove it yet.

If you do a google or youtube search for “The Great Global Warming Swindle” you can see the direct correlation sunspot activity vs global temperature. As the Sunspot activity goes down, the magnetic field of the the sun is weaker, and that allows more cosmic rays into out solar system. The reverse is also true. That is why over the past 30 years, every planet in our solar system that has weather has experienced warming. According to Mr Gore, Mars has global warming because someone parked their SuV there. :)

REPLY: FYI this is a different Anthony than the blog host

]]> By: New AMS draft policy statement links Hurricane Katrina and climate « Watts Up With That? http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-8003 New AMS draft policy statement links Hurricane Katrina and climate « Watts Up With That? Thu, 13 Mar 2008 03:43:18 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-8003 [...] top of that, just last month, NOAA issued a press release saying that “There  is nothing in the U.S. hurricane damage record  that indicates global warming has caused... The source of the press release was the National Hurricane Center, from Chris Landsea, one of the [...] [...] top of that, just last month, NOAA issued a press release saying that “There  is nothing in the U.S. hurricane damage record  that indicates global warming has caused… The source of the press release was the National Hurricane Center, from Chris Landsea, one of the [...]

]]> By: Jeff Alberts (was Jeff in Seattle) http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6844 Jeff Alberts (was Jeff in Seattle) Fri, 29 Feb 2008 20:35:54 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6844 <blockquote>And more cosmic rays leads to more efficient cloud nucleation,</blockquote> I thought that theory was still very much up in the air.

And more cosmic rays leads to more efficient cloud nucleation,

I thought that theory was still very much up in the air.

]]> By: George E. Smith http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6834 George E. Smith Fri, 29 Feb 2008 18:59:12 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6834 I find it interesting that these four reporting agencies like to describe their temperature data as anomalies; and people like to look for "trends" in the data. And of course the perceived trend depends on how long a time interval you select, adn when you start it, and when you end it. Then the four reporting groups use different "baseline" preiods for their temperature scales. There is nothing at all anomalous about these temperature data; they are (purportedly) what was actually measured in that scientific laboratory known as planet earth; they actually happened as they are recorded here. So don't look for trends; the only trend present in any of those data sets, is the progression from one measured data point to the next data point. If you want to look at trends Jut take the Mauna Loa obsevatory CO2 data and plot it on the same time scale graphs, that the four reporting agency's data is plotted on. And then try if you dare, to find any correlation whatsoever between the actually measured temperature data, and the actually measured CO2 data. You won't find any, because their simply isn't any. I must say, I really appreciate your work. The flat sunspot siuation probably implies that the earth's cosmic ray flux, is currently at some sort of high level, maybe historically high. And more cosmic rays leads to more efficient cloud nucleation, so I would bet that this period of sudden cold, occurring even though there was increased global precipitation, means we had unusually high lgobal cloud cover during that precipitous temperature drop; and cosmic rays had a lot to do with it. I find it interesting that these four reporting agencies like to describe their temperature data as anomalies; and people like to look for “trends” in the data. And of course the perceived trend depends on how long a time interval you select, adn when you start it, and when you end it. Then the four reporting groups use different “baseline” preiods for their temperature scales.
There is nothing at all anomalous about these temperature data; they are (purportedly) what was actually measured in that scientific laboratory known as planet earth; they actually happened as they are recorded here.
So don’t look for trends; the only trend present in any of those data sets, is the progression from one measured data point to the next data point.

If you want to look at trends Jut take the Mauna Loa obsevatory CO2 data and plot it on the same time scale graphs, that the four reporting agency’s data is plotted on. And then try if you dare, to find any correlation whatsoever between the actually measured temperature data, and the actually measured CO2 data. You won’t find any, because their simply isn’t any.

I must say, I really appreciate your work. The flat sunspot siuation probably implies that the earth’s cosmic ray flux, is currently at some sort of high level, maybe historically high. And more cosmic rays leads to more efficient cloud nucleation, so I would bet that this period of sudden cold, occurring even though there was increased global precipitation, means we had unusually high lgobal cloud cover during that precipitous temperature drop; and cosmic rays had a lot to do with it.

]]> By: Gregg E. http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6793 Gregg E. Fri, 29 Feb 2008 10:21:36 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6793 What I love to use to put a cork in the AGW nutbars is Typhoon Tip. Tip was the largest tropical storm ever on record. How large? Over 3,000 MILES in diameter at its peak. Fortunately it greatly diminished before making landfall. When was this "mother of all storms"? NINETEEN SEVENTY-NINE, at the height of an unusually active Pacific typhoon season. Perhaps it was just overcompensating for the tiny name it got stuck with... What I love to use to put a cork in the AGW nutbars is Typhoon Tip. Tip was the largest tropical storm ever on record. How large? Over 3,000 MILES in diameter at its peak. Fortunately it greatly diminished before making landfall.

When was this “mother of all storms”? NINETEEN SEVENTY-NINE, at the height of an unusually active Pacific typhoon season.

Perhaps it was just overcompensating for the tiny name it got stuck with…

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6363 Evan Jones Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:25:57 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6363 Stan: Check. Answered there. Stan: Check. Answered there.

]]> By: Evan Jones http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6353 Evan Jones Mon, 25 Feb 2008 19:32:32 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6353 Being reasonable and having the facts on one's side--and not giving ground--is an extremely powerful weapon. Sometimes it won't do to use weapons used against you. Not if the weapon (scorn, belittlement) has no place on the field of conflict. Part of the reason we are in this "conflict" is that we object to the use of those weapons in the first place. Lots of people don't know any better. It is on us to change that. Yeah, it's an unfair burden, but if it were fair we wouldn't be here in the first place. The majority of the folks out there think they are doing the right thing. We've got to change their opinion, not do to them what they are trying to do to us. Noblesse oblige ain't easy, but it's what we're stuck with, and it's our best, most honest weapon. We lean over and knock them back against the ropes. But we don't stomp on them when they're down; we offer them our hand and help them back up. Because we are intellectuals and this is a debate over facts, not values. Today's rank-and-file opponents are tomorrow's neutrals--and allies. Besides, BG isn't trying to nuke us, he is well within the acceptable rules of engagement. Would that all the "other side" was! Plus, we have to consider the terrain once the "war" is over. The real objective is to change the entire terrain of the debate so something like this flap won't happen again. Being reasonable and having the facts on one’s side–and not giving ground–is an extremely powerful weapon. Sometimes it won’t do to use weapons used against you. Not if the weapon (scorn, belittlement) has no place on the field of conflict. Part of the reason we are in this “conflict” is that we object to the use of those weapons in the first place.

Lots of people don’t know any better. It is on us to change that. Yeah, it’s an unfair burden, but if it were fair we wouldn’t be here in the first place. The majority of the folks out there think they are doing the right thing. We’ve got to change their opinion, not do to them what they are trying to do to us.

Noblesse oblige ain’t easy, but it’s what we’re stuck with, and it’s our best, most honest weapon. We lean over and knock them back against the ropes. But we don’t stomp on them when they’re down; we offer them our hand and help them back up. Because we are intellectuals and this is a debate over facts, not values. Today’s rank-and-file opponents are tomorrow’s neutrals–and allies.

Besides, BG isn’t trying to nuke us, he is well within the acceptable rules of engagement. Would that all the “other side” was!

Plus, we have to consider the terrain once the “war” is over. The real objective is to change the entire terrain of the debate so something like this flap won’t happen again.

]]> By: Stan Needham http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6352 Stan Needham Mon, 25 Feb 2008 19:04:52 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6352 Evan, Check out my comments at the end of the <a href="http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/2008/02/17/cedarville-and-giss-adjustments/" rel="nofollow">Cedarville and GISS Adjustment thread</a>, and get back to me. Evan,

Check out my comments at the end of the Cedarville and GISS Adjustment thread, and get back to me.

]]> By: Bruce Cobb http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6348 Bruce Cobb Mon, 25 Feb 2008 17:07:38 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6348 "But we MUST NOT fight fire with fire". Hmmm... While we're sitting around singing Kumbaya, they're busy laughing, and plotting their next move. When you pick up a weapon, you can't whine and complain if it then gets used against you. The only weapon we WON'T use is their nuclear one; that of lies. But, you're right, I do feel sorry for BG. He just doesn't know any better. “But we MUST NOT fight fire with fire”. Hmmm… While we’re sitting around singing Kumbaya, they’re busy laughing, and plotting their next move. When you pick up a weapon, you can’t whine and complain if it then gets used against you. The only weapon we WON’T use is their nuclear one; that of lies. But, you’re right, I do feel sorry for BG. He just doesn’t know any better.

]]> By: Yet another inconvenient story ignored by the MSM. « Watts Up With That? http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/02/21/noaa-hurricane-frequency-and-global-warming-not-the-cause-of-increased-destruction/#comment-6332 Yet another inconvenient story ignored by the MSM. « Watts Up With That? Mon, 25 Feb 2008 13:24:57 +0000 http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?p=744#comment-6332 [...] week, I broke the story of a press release issued by NOAA where they publish an opinion smashing any link between [...] [...] week, I broke the story of a press release issued by NOAA where they publish an opinion smashing any link between [...]

]]>